1973 Fifty Pence Silver Piedfort Rumour

Obverse of 1973 Fifty Pence Cupro-Nickel Proof Our image of a normal coin.

Reverse of 1973 Fifty Pence Cupro-Nickel Proof Our image of a normal coin.

1973 Fifty Pence Cupro-Nickel Proof in Box Vendors image.

Another Urban Myth?
After the 1933 penny , the necklet two pound coin, the 1983 Two New Pence stories, and many more, we guess writing in November 2004, that the next one, silly story, that is, will be the 1973 fifty pence silver piedfort.

According to the Spink Standard Catalogue
The piedfort version first appeared in the 2003 edition of this book, and states that the piedfort version is:-

Struck in very small numbers in silver on thicker blank. sometimes referred to as a piedfort but not twice the weight of the regular cupro-nickel currency issue. The pieces were presented to EEC Finance Ministers, and possibly senior officials on the occasion of the United Kingdom joining the European Economic Community.

Another eBay Con?
We estimate that about half the coins we see offered for sale on eBay are incorrectly described, sometimes slightly overgraded, but often so badly described that we believe that the vendor is being either negligent, perhaps through ignorance, or deliberately fraudulent. Only a few days before we wrote this page, we noticed a 1973 fifty pence silver piedfort proof being offered on eBay, and watched it with interest. so that you can share the experience, we will reproduce the relevant details of the eBay listing and results.

eBay Item # 3938511070
SUPERB 1973 EEC HANDS SILVER PROOF PIEDFORT 50P CASED!
Vendor: wellbid (Feedback 2805)

Superb and Scarce Official Royal Mint 1973 EEC "Hands" Solid Silver Fifty Pence Piedfort Proof Coin in Case

Item A Marvellous and Scarce Vintage Royal Mint Solid Silver 1973 Piedfort Proof EEC 50P Coin, in Case.

This superb Royal Mint Silver Piedfort Proof Coin was issued in 1973 to commemorate the UK's accession to the European Economic Community (EEC), and is a special Proof Piedfort issue, being double the thickness of the standard 50P coin and struck to an extremely high Proof standard, with sharp, clear detailing and brilliant Royal Mint polished finish. The Fifty Pence Commemorative Proof Coin is struck of Solid Silver, weighing over 12 Grams on digital scales, and is in absolutely superb condition as can be seen, having never been removed from its original sealed protective satchet. The 50P Silver Proof Coin depicts a bust of Her Majesty The Queen Elizabeth II to the obverse, with an illustration of the then nine hands of the EEC to the reverse, surrounding the wording "1973 50 PENCE". The Coin also comes complete with its original marvellous quality Royal Mint presentation case, with soft plush upper inner lining, velvet-lined lower and quality leatherette case, and this marvellous piece really displays wonderfully as can be seen, a superb, rare and very pleasing 1973 Piedfort Silver 50P Proof coin, depicting the hands of the EEC.

A Really Marvellous and Scarce Vintage Royal Mint Solid Silver 50P Commemorative Piedfort EEC Proof Coin, that will make a superb addition to a collection.

Please see the pictures below and do not hesitate to ask any questions if you need more information.

Overseas buyers are welcome, contact us for postage details and payment options. We can also accept PayPal, a convenient way to pay for your auction purchase. Final winning bid exclusive of postage/shipping. See our "PowerSeller" feedback for your confidence and enjoy bidding on this Superb and Scarce Official Royal Mint 1973 EEC "Hands" Solid Silver Fifty Pence Piedfort Proof Coin in Case.

Please do also see our other auctions where there are many more items of interest.

Results
Winning bid: £72.01
Ended: 07-Nov-04 00:02:08 GMT
Start time: 31-Oct-04 01:02:08 BST
History: 16 bids (£0.99 starting bid)
Winning bidder: ggc1948 (178)

Bid History Page

User ID	Bid Amount	Date of bid
ggc1948 ( 178)	£72.01	07-Nov-04 00:01:05 GMT
crusadersales ( 560)	£70.01	07-Nov-04 00:01:59 GMT
ggc1948 ( 178)	£60.00	07-Nov-04 00:00:38 GMT
234kin ( 18)	£55.00	06-Nov-04 23:21:13 GMT
234kin ( 18)	£50.00	06-Nov-04 22:16:22 GMT
234kin ( 18)	£30.00	06-Nov-04 20:52:34 GMT
jmgo950 ( 50)	£28.10	06-Nov-04 21:09:01 GMT
kevinrsents ( 119)	£25.00	06-Nov-04 18:38:53 GMT
234kin ( 18)	£20.00	06-Nov-04 17:47:37 GMT
kevinrsents ( 119)	£20.00	06-Nov-04 18:36:04 GMT
234kin ( 18)	£15.00	02-Nov-04 23:15:24 GMT
yrutaz ( 21)	£15.00	04-Nov-04 21:09:10 GMT
kevinrsents ( 119)	£10.00	31-Oct-04 07:05:16 GMT
retrievers02 ( 21)	£8.00	31-Oct-04 19:57:18 GMT
13steve10 ( 22)	£7.00	31-Oct-04 16:57:54 GMT
13steve10 ( 22)	£5.00	31-Oct-04 16:57:41 GMT

More Information
Visit our £2's For Sale page.

Worth Keeping Coins From Change?

If you want to find the value of a coin you own, please take a look at our page I've Found An Old Coin, What's It Worth?
Or you could check out our £2 Coin Values page.

Please...
If you are going to ask us whether the 50 pence coin you own is worth more than 50 pence, please, please, please read our other pages about them first, and even then the answer is almost certainly no. About 1,000 people every week read one or more of our pages about £2 coins. Hopefully most manage to find what they wanted. A tiny percentage, but still about 20 per week ask us whether a coin they have found in change / in a drawer / been given is worth more than £2. The answer to 99% of these questions is already on our site. We do not have the time or patience to answer such questions individually.

Buying Coins
We also buy coins, please see our We Buy Coins page.

Mis-Described - Not Silver - Not a Piedfort
We have never seen a silver piedfort proof version of this coin, but from the vendors description and photographs, we conclude that this coins is clearly a normal base metal cupro-nickel proof. Firstly it is in the same cheap leatherette box as the common proof, and we would expect that a V.I.P. proof coin would be presented more grandly. Secondly the vendors stated weight at "over 12 grams" corresponds closely to that of the normal coin at 13.5 grams, which he could easily have checked on our website, and many other places. We have shown a data table below with the specifications of the early fifty pences, those issued between 1969 and 1997. We have had to estimate the weight of the 1973 piedforts, and have quoted the same figure as for other fifty pence piedfort issues. According to the Spink Standard Catalogue, the 1973 issue is heavier and thicker than normal, but is not a full double weight piedfort, even so, we would expect the 1973 piedfort to be at least 50% thicker and heavier than normal at around 20 grams, and 3.6 mms thick.
There appears no other evidence which could lead an intelligent and honest person to believe it to be a piedfort, such as it being made of silver, which has a different colour from cupro-nickel.

eBay Trader With Feedback 2805 Should Know Better
If we were being very kind, or perhaps naive, we might give this seller the benefit of the doubt, and assume he had misdescribed the coin in pure ignorance, but even this would be hard to defend considering his expert sounding description. We encounter people every day who think their half sovereign is a sovereign, or their brass jeton is a gold guinea, so we do understand something about human nature, and that people often believe what they want to believe.
We do not believe however that this trader is guilty of negligence or ignorance. If he does not know the coin to be a very rare piedfort, he should say so, research the coin, or have it appraised by an expert. In our view it is disgraceful that any trader should describe this as a silver piedfort proof, and this vendor should be prosecuted by Trading Standards under the Trade Descriptions Act. It probably will not happen.

Specifications of 1973 & Other Large Fifty Pences

Version	Diameter	Depth	Alloy	Weight
Uncirculated	30	2.4	Cupro-Nickel	13.5
Proof	30	2.4	Cupro-Nickel	13.5
Piedfort	30	4.8*	Silver	27.0*

Notes
* = Estimated Approximate

What About the Price?
We as dealers have no particular desire to acquire one of these silver piedforts, but they are listed in the 2005 Spink at £1,500 and in Coin Year Book 2005 at £750. Although that is quite a significant difference, and it is hard to judge which book would be closer, but we would be quite happy to pay say £500 for one. Why did the vendor auction on eBay at a starting price of £0.99 when he could have sold it to us with no hassle for much more. £72.01 is far more than the £3 which we currently charge for a cupro-nickel proof.

Greedy Buyers?
Did the buyers get what they deserved? Why do they not look at the vendors other goods, and see that, at the time of writing at least, only 3 out of 44 items for sale were coins, and most of the rest were Dinky toys? Why did they not bother to check the specifications of a normal fifty pence coin? Do they honestly think they will get a £1,500 coin for the amount they bid? Yet 8 different bidders made bids starting at £5 for this coin. Perhaps the vendor is hoping that the buyer will be too embarrassed by his greed and stupidity to complain.

Next Urban Myth?
Only about a week after the eBay sale above, we got a telephone call from somebody else who had got one of these piedforts, or so he told a member of our staff. We asked what made him believe it was a silver piedfort, and he replied because it was in a box. Now my grandfather has been in a box for some time, but that doesn't mean that he's turned to silver or doubled in weight. Next the caller put his "knowledgeable" friend on the phone, who proceeded to waste half an hour of our staff member's time. Some dealers would deal with this type of enquiry more efficiently by saying bring the coin in for appraisal and bringing the conversation to a rapid end. Perhaps we should do the same. At one time our staff member was about to suggest that the person posted the coin to us, and I interrupted to tell her not to do that under any circumstances. If we invited everybody to post us their old coins for appraisal, it would cost us a fortune in return postage. Part of the skill we need is to try to sort out the likely good coins from the 99% of junk we get offered or brain-picked about, and do so fairly efficiently so we don't get too much time wasted. I could have taken over the telephone call personalIy do not believe in this as it is better staff training for them to learn how to handle most calls. That way I can get on with some of the vital work such as grading and cataloguing coins, and dealing with real customers.
One of the things I said to our staff member was that if the man only thinks he has got a rarity, rather than knowing he has got one, then he hasn't. What's more, even if he "knows" he has got one, I would only believe it when I saw it or he gave me some convincing reasons why it should be. Why do I fear that this 50p silver piedfort might be the next urban coin myth? They all start slowly and gather momentum. Hearing about two in one week is enough to ring alarm bells.
We have provided this information page so that future lunatics will read it and learn rather than telephone us.